Neurodivergence, the Joy of Singing, and the Queen of Rock 'n' Roll with Chelsea, The Voice Witch

Chelsea and I

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[00:00:00] Ashley: So welcome everybody to Dying With the Divine. I'm Ashley, I'm your host, and together we'll be ex exploring the magical, mystical, cultural, historical, everything in between. And today's episode, we're gonna have a really good time talking about why do people even bother singing and we'll, we'll talk about the mother of rock and roll.

[00:00:29] So thanks everybody for coming and showing up today. I hope you're having a great week, and if not, I hope it's getting a lot better. So today, I'm super, super excited. We have a really great guest, Chelsea Camon. Is here. She is the voice witch. So Chelsea is a trained singer, sound and reiki energy healer.

[00:00:51] After earning her ma from Columbia University in music and music education, she hungered for more knowledge. In these is esoteric and mystical. [00:01:00] She coaches creatives on how to use their voices and expressed their desires. She just released a podcast called BR Seasons, which I've listened to for several times is very good.

[00:01:09] Where she has conversations with her co-host, yada Abdul, surrounding their spiritual awakenings, as well as giving tips and tick. Giving tips and tricks for navigating a spiritual life. So, hey Chelsea. How you

[00:01:23] Chelsea: doing? Hello. Oh my gosh, I'm so happy to be here. I'm very excited for this. I'm happy to support you and yeah, that, that's all right, that's all true.

[00:01:33] Everything she said is true. Yay. We're telling

[00:01:36] Ashley: the truth today. That's great.

[00:01:39] Chelsea: Perfect. Off to a good start. One o'clock.

[00:01:44] Ashley: I love it. So my first question for you is, well, let's start at the very beginning, cuz I like to start there. So you like you said, you've gotten your ma in sing music and music education.

[00:01:57] So I'm guessing you started singing when you [00:02:00] were young. Yeah. Like how long have you been singing? Yes. I, I

[00:02:04] Chelsea: have been singing for a very long time. I mean, Since I was three, I really, I knew that I would, you know, but I, I think there are a lot of kids that start singing as kids. Mm-hmm. But I was very into theatrics, mm-hmm.

[00:02:19] Very into costuming, design, theater. And that always held, held a space in my heart, and I would just hyper focus on like Barbara Streisand films and Judy Garland records and like, just really normal behavior for like an eight year old. You know, just totally normal. And my, my parents introduced me to like, those films, old films, funny girl.

[00:02:41] I don't know if anyone understands anything that I'm saying. It's just really old films by really old people now. That's, that's my niche. And so I would just watch these movie musicals and watch them on repeat. And that only encouraged me to sing [00:03:00] that repertoire because, you know, after you watch a movie, you wanna sing those songs.

[00:03:03] Yeah. And then I realized, Hmm, okay. I kind of have this golden oldies voice that's fun. And then that pipeline to like musical theater, jazz. And then when I went to college, I, I studied classical music. Mm-hmm. Classical singing. So I was trained technically as far as a classical singer because that's kind of like what's mostly encouraged in Western music schooling.

[00:03:25] Mm-hmm. So the thing is, I was, I was breaking through my, my fiance at the time, my husband now has a degree in jazz studies, so mm-hmm. There was a jazz opportunity at. The school that we went to for undergrad, cuz that's where we met. Mm-hmm. And so I just did the best I could. There were jazz voice, jazz classes and I would take that on the side and also incorporate that repertoire.

[00:03:49] So like, I would have like a jazz set at a recital. Mm-hmm. So I, I always was striving to also keep singing a like American popular song. Mm-hmm. And keeping that part of me alive [00:04:00] too. But also like very understanding of like, You know, the, the ins and outs of classical and the, and why I should also be like, well versed in that, you know, I wasn't, it wasn't like, I was like, b I don't like this.

[00:04:11] Like, I wanted to be like cultured. Like there was this like, you know, like I wanted to have that independent study and, and be able to like, have repertoire. And I knew as I studied it that it would only benefit me moving forward because I knew in some capacity I was gonna be teaching music. Mm-hmm. I knew that having this repoire would be helpful for the future, whether or not I sang it.

[00:04:33] So I had that kind of knowledge already. I, I knew that was coming. Mm-hmm. And then I finished my undergrad and I, I was student taught, I was slated to teach in private schools. But I just really never wanted to do it. Mm-hmm. It was just something, you know, like I, I student taught, but it was really not the greatest experience for me.

[00:04:58] Come to find out I am [00:05:00] late diagnosed autistic, adhd. Mm-hmm. So schooling in itself can be very, very traumatizing. Now imagine someone, I'm sure now imagine a person who has been traumatized by the school system try to teach within that school system. Mm-hmm. It's even more traumatizing because it really opens up all of the inadequacies within our systems.

[00:05:19] Mm-hmm. And it just becomes like really Just a aggressively in your face. Like, oh, the, the, there are a lot of issues here. Like the way, the way the system is designed as we know, right? Yeah. So it was just frustrating for me and I knew that I wanted to forge a path very early on. I knew I always was going to beat to my old own drum.

[00:05:41] Mm-hmm. Even though family was like, you just got 60 years worth of music degrees. What do you mean you're gonna start teaching privately, going door to door in your car? What are you like, what are you crazy? Like, tra also, you know, I'm like, what? Traveling the harsh tr terrain of suburban Long Island.

[00:05:59] I'm gonna [00:06:00] be okay.

[00:06:02] Ashley: Like,

[00:06:04] Chelsea: and like wealthy areas too. Like

[00:06:08] Ashley: I love that. Like,

[00:06:11] Chelsea: they were like, it's just, I remember I was pregnant and somebody was like, oh, you're gonna be like going from door to door with your kid. I'm like, My kid's not coming to work with me. I'm not impoverished. Like this is how I make a living so that I can have help at home.

[00:06:27] You're like, my

[00:06:28] Ashley: kid is inside my

[00:06:30] Chelsea: body still. Right, right, right. They're ready to, they'll be about it. Yeah. Which goes to show you how much people also like to comment on women's bodies and what of course you're gonna do after, like just when you are a pregnant woman in America. Pregnant femme presenting.

[00:06:45] Mm-hmm. Oh, Lord Almighty. Everyone has a comment. This. This conversation's gonna get derailed several times. It's no problem. Music study too. I know too, I love, I love how much you're laughing. This is great for [00:07:00] me, this is no, cause I'm thinking like

[00:07:03] Ashley: I love you. I think of like seven other things. So first of all, I have to go back to the school piece to me.

[00:07:08] Yes.

[00:07:09] Chelsea: Yeah. Because like

[00:07:10] Ashley: I speak to me. I love you. I love you too. You're great. , I just think to myself, so I don't have any type of diagnosis, but I just think that I, sitting in school for hours on end, I couldn't do it. Like I'm not meant for it. So anybody who

[00:07:27] Chelsea: I would just associate, man, I don't even remember school.

[00:07:30] Like I was the like what El What is pertinent. Exactly.

[00:07:34] Ashley: So I was just like, so when you were saying that, I'm like, man, first, like for anybody who, and I have several friends who have ADHD and like, You know, anybody wants, like any type of neuro divergence, I'm like, I don't know how you guys did it cuz I'm, I don't know, I've never done testing or anything, but I'll sit there sometimes I'm like, I can't, I can't do this.

[00:07:52] Even like mathematics, I'm not good at math. Oh. And everybody's like, oh, you shouldn't say that.

[00:07:57] Chelsea: Right. How can you be bad like that? It's like, yeah. [00:08:00]

[00:08:00] Ashley: And I'm like, no, I'm bad. So like my parents, God bless him, especially my dad, he was just like, if you get a seat, it's fine. Cuz I know you tried to get that seat right.

[00:08:09] I was

[00:08:09] Chelsea: like, I was like Right. Like they knew they at least knew what you were capable of. Yes. And didn't force you to, to try to be at another level of capability.

[00:08:19] Ashley: No, exactly. I'm like, I'm good at history and I'm, I read a lot of books and my parents were like, good, that's fine. Just do

[00:08:26] Chelsea: that. And I'm like, we all have our intelligences.

[00:08:29] This is so true. Exactly. So

[00:08:31] Ashley: And I always think like, Man, we really try to make kids sit down for hours. Oh my God, it's so, so true. And just how, what are we doing? I don't think that's okay.

[00:08:40] Chelsea: No, I don't either. It's, I know, I don't either. I, I, I vacillate because like, I have a kid now, she's four.

[00:08:49] Mm-hmm. And. I am like, I don't know how she's gonna do in the school system. I'm like, mm-hmm. Every day I'm like, God bless you. I hope you're not like me. And [00:09:00] then every day I like watch her on like the little nanny cams in her preschool classroom. Yeah. And I'm just like, oh God, she's alone again. And I send pictures of her alone, like just always playing alone to my husband.

[00:09:10] And he's like so devastated by this. And I'm like, yeah, but she's vibing. She does not care. Like, yes. You know, it's just hard to see your child probably also autistic. Yes. Like, like, it's hard. It's hard. It is hard because we, we are so ableist in our society and like the norm is to think like everyone gets along and we are social and we, and we share.

[00:09:34] And some brains just like, Doing their own work. It's fine. It's fine.

[00:09:39] Ashley: Your daughter is me. I used to just like be by myself and I, I was fine. Yeah.

[00:09:44] Chelsea: I was just like, right. Yes. Only, only in my memories am I like, oh, that was sad.

[00:09:49] Ashley: Right. I know. And I feel like it's other people telling you like, yes, but you were by yourself.

[00:09:53] And I'm like, yeah. But I was reading my books and I was just I made up fantastical stories about all sorts of things. Oh my. I

[00:09:59] Chelsea: [00:10:00] having a great time. Oh, Ashley, we have to talk. Did you sit alone at recess? Yes. Several

[00:10:07] Ashley: times to win.

[00:10:10] Chelsea: All I did was sit at recess or talk to the teachers.

[00:10:13] Ashley: Oh, that was my other thing.

[00:10:14] That's a big one. You know how I made friends in school? This is so shady. So when I was, I had friends in my neighborhood. Some, some, but it's a long story. But anyway, I

[00:10:25] Chelsea: under understood, I think I read way between the lines right there. I, it's fine.

[00:10:30] Ashley: But like, So when I was like in, I think I started this in fourth, fifth grade for some reason I, I got like bullied and stuff, but also like other people knew that I was a steel trap.

[00:10:42] Like you could tell me something and I wouldn't really tell other people. So other kids would be like, oh Ashley, I have a problem. And I'd be like, tell me your problem. So I made a book, like a burn book. Like you, me girls,

[00:10:53] Chelsea: I love this. This is like very, but it's like Harriet, right? The yes. Oh my God. Why Harriet?

[00:10:59] The Spy. [00:11:00] Yes. Yes.

[00:11:01] Ashley: It's like that. And like I was, I was recalling this the other day. I was like, man, maybe I'm a bad person because I used to keep this book and I had poo liked two in the book. Get giving

[00:11:10] Chelsea: Neuro Divergent. My friends, the more you talk, I'm like, I

[00:11:15] Ashley: might be, I dunno. I think so

[00:11:17] Chelsea: every day, every day I tell Kenyata I'm like, I'm just saying.

[00:11:22] She's like, I don't, and then the other day she's like, just shy of autistic. I'm the jury's out on that. Like now I've got her saying, I don't know, maybe like, it's like one day of being friends with Chelsea, one week of being friends with Chelsea, you know? And then it's like two months being friends with Chelsea.

[00:11:40] Listen, I found this book and I'm starting to, you know, it's like you start to, because we don't know what we don't know. Yeah. You know? And, and our normal is our normal. So like Exactly. Just going through life with our own little systems that like surviving. Exactly. Like,

[00:11:56] Ashley: this makes sense to me. I used to just record [00:12:00] everybody's business and I love that.

[00:12:02] I know it's like, and not like, I wouldn't threaten people, but like everyone knew I knew, so they had to stop messing with me a little bit. Oh. Cause I was like, I was like, say something to me again. And I'm telling her that you like her and I'm telling everything you said, you hold good. I'm like, I caused a fight one time.

[00:12:22] Not great. I told this one, I knew this one boy liked this girl that I was like kind of cool with. And then I knew another boy liked her. So I told this one boy that she was saying stuff about him to the other guy because this boy was making fun of me

[00:12:35] Chelsea: and I didn't like him. She made a messy yes.

[00:12:38] Honestly. Yes. Just was, was that for justice? Oh my God,

[00:12:44] Ashley: I was mad.

[00:12:47] Chelsea: I'm, you know, in extremes. No, because the thing is you feel like now this is turning into a therapy session and then we'll talk about whatever the hell I do, but. But an extreme sense of justice is [00:13:00] also an autism treat, and apparently it wasn't just because I'm like some hard Italian that like, likes to complain.

[00:13:08] Also, I'm Jewish. Yeah. So like, like I was like, maybe it's just cultural. Maybe it's just like, because you know, Jews, there's a thing called fetching mm-hmm. Where we kind of like complain, but it's, you know, just like about something ancillary, like non-important. Just like a small thing. Like, ooh, there's a draft.

[00:13:28] I hate that. You know, like, yeah. But then the Italian side, I was like, maybe, maybe I'm just really aggressive and I get it from my grandpa, and then I'm like, Oh, shoot. I think my Italian grandpa had autism. Like, I'm just like, oh, is it Italian or is it actually just like you're, they were overstimulated, overwhelmed, mofos, like, just struggling out here.

[00:13:48] I'm like, Hmm. I'm just really unpacking a lot. Anywho, did you, what,

[00:13:53] Ashley: what was your other question? No, it's, we're gonna get to it. Cause now I have another comment. Oh my

[00:13:57] Chelsea: God, I love

[00:13:58] Ashley: it. This is great. [00:14:00] Okay. I am at work especially, and throughout my life I have been known to be a little too honest. Sure. Yeah.

[00:14:09] A little too, because when I have a problem, everybody's like, oh my God. And I can't even believe she said that. And I'm the one who's like, Hey, you, why'd you say that? Yeah, yeah. Let's talk about it like, like I do this at work. Yeah. With this one person at my job who everybody will like say stuff, oh, blah, blah, blah, blah.

[00:14:26] But when they come around, I'm like, Hey, you. Explain this. Like let's talk about Yes. And everyone's like, oh

[00:14:32] Chelsea: my God, I can't believe you're just saying it. I can't believe she's just starting something in the office right now. It's like, I'm not, and they think you're starting something. Yes. But you're just trying to bring it to light because I don't wanna talk about it anymore.

[00:14:40] Like,

[00:14:41] Ashley: let's get over it. You want it to be done. Yes. Yes.

[00:14:43] Chelsea: I'm willing to go through the fire to get to the other side. Yes. Where there's paradise. Most people are comfortable with a low flame for hours. I hate it. I don't like that either. No. I don't like

[00:14:55] Ashley: this disturbing, like, I don't like when we have, we we're all upset.[00:15:00]

[00:15:00] I literally lost a friend like two years ago. Well, almost, this is somebody I work with who I have to sit next to every day, who will not speak to me, who I used to be very good friends with, because my awkward, it's so awkward. She started basically being super shady to me, making little comments. So one day I got a little snappy and I think I said something to her like, oh, okay, you wanna start something or whatever.

[00:15:23] Not like that. Not that you wanna go, yeah, no, I like, but I get it. I, yes, I said something and then she's like, oh my God, I can't even deal with you. So I realized that like what I had said was in public and I was like, okay, I shouldn't have said this in public. So I was like, listen. Let's go in this back room and talk.

[00:15:37] So I took her to the back room. I did. Oh, Chelsea shit. Which this sounds like

[00:15:41] Chelsea: Oprah's don't never go to location two.

[00:15:43] Ashley: Exactly. I'm like, no, no, no. We're gonna go in the back room. I said, these are, I said, number one, I'm sorry that I was snapping to you just now. Maybe that was unnecessary. I, but you already took accountability.

[00:15:53] Yeah. I said, I know I was being a little bitchy. I apologize. I said, but these are the things that you've done that hurt my feelings. And I just wanna, and I told [00:16:00] her, let's get it out. I we're friends. Right. Let's, we're supposed to chit chat. Let Yeah. Yeah. And to this day, and this girl, and the whole time she's like, well, you're mad at I'm, I'm, this podcast is not about this.

[00:16:10] I'm sorry, but like, but she was basically saying like, I was mad at her and that's my problem, blah, blah, blah. Right. This girl will not speak to me. It's not a problem. I don't care anymore. But it's just like, right. Why do you wanna have a problem? Like we're, especially if we were supposed to be friends, like, yes, yes.

[00:16:25] Let's, let's talk about it and clear the, and I've had other friends in my life who like are good friends who we've done that and we cleared the air and it was over. Yes. Like, yes.

[00:16:33] Chelsea: Us. I think some people perceive us not as, as close as we perceive we are with them. Yeah. So we'll care and bring it to light.

[00:16:43] And then those people tend to be like, all right, it wasn't even that deep. Yeah. And we're like, are you kidding me? It is deep. You're in my friend's circle now. Ew. Like, I know. Like you can't, I just, what? Yes. And it confuses us. Oh. Oh, Ashley. It's, [00:17:00] and I'm

[00:17:00] Ashley: If I hurt your feelings, like I did something to my sister and I hurt her feelings.

[00:17:05] And she was like, Ashley, I didn't like this. I was like, oh, I didn't even know that was a problem. I'm sorry. And then we're over it and yeah, I know it's my sister and I love her, but like anybody, I just want that level of comfort. Yeah. Like, just tell me that I messed up and I'll, I'm not right all the time.

[00:17:19] It's not a

[00:17:19] Chelsea: big deal. Right. You're not look right, you're not looking. Exactly. No, I'm. I'm with you. Who knows? Maybe

[00:17:27] Ashley: I don't know what's going on in my brain, but I'm glad to hear that this is not, but I

[00:17:31] Chelsea: under No, yeah, no, because having like being neuro divergent, having a neuro divergent brain, there's something that makes us feel like we must be a bad person, but it's like literally our symptoms.

[00:17:42] Okay, good. It's unfortunately not even like a part of, it's not even like Ashley developed this tumor in her brain and like it makes her wanna say these things and it's like, Nope, nope. You're actually, your brain is wired to think like this and it's not, and it's not your fault.

[00:17:59] Ashley: [00:18:00] Well, I, I know, again, never been tested, but I, I might need to get tested because I, I, it's so funny, I constantly think like the other day,

[00:18:07] Chelsea: send link.

[00:18:07] I know, yeah. To the RA czar. That's how I started. I started, I mean, there are so many reasons to also not get diagnosed. Mm-hmm. For, yeah, you, I'll send you a lot of research things, but for purposes like insurance, if I needed support, if I had to get support needs, it works and it goes through. Mm-hmm.

[00:18:28] But you could also get a healthcare provider that just says like trans, you know, life transition. Mm-hmm. And can still get you you know, any sort of support needs if need be, or any medications that you might need. Mm-hmm. The medication that I'm on Wasn't even given to me under the a s d dsm, you know?

[00:18:46] Mm-hmm. Diagnosis. It was literally under like life adjustment because I was le I was leaving New York and moving to Indiana. Mm-hmm. So it just depends on the type of support needs, and I haven't even researched it fully, fully up. Because it was just [00:19:00] important for me to also get that validation, like for my own journey.

[00:19:03] To know, okay, I'm not like going totally crazy here. But having that brain affected my work in schools and how much I could really bring to the table. But I also knew how much I was kind of butting heads with you know, superintendents and my bosses, and. You know, I, I knew that I wasn't like cut out for it.

[00:19:23] I knew that I was different, but I also knew I had a different side to me that was like very like, people please and like, yeah. I, I just wanted to do right by people. I wanted to be sweet and kind. And yeah, it just was a different version of me that I was just like, people pleasing a lot and thus masking entirely.

[00:19:40] So it really did affect my quality of life and affected like, how I could work so I could really only work under the paradigm of working in studios where I was like one-on-one with students. Mm-hmm. Working for other people, but even that, it really wasn't the best. I would do that for like, extra extra work.

[00:19:59] Mm-hmm. [00:20:00] Like, you know, just as like a, you know, stable income. And then I would have my my own private studio that I started pretty much right out the gate, like. Oh, like I started right after my masters. I worked a year in a studio and then made some connections within that community. Just people that saw me going to the musicals and things like that.

[00:20:20] Like I just started really small. It's basically the online version of, you know, what we do in Witch and Famous and like mm-hmm. How she teaches us to like market. Mm-hmm. But it's basically like I made a couple of connections, you know, just like making conversation online and like talking to people and reaching out.

[00:20:36] But I would, I would make a couple of connections. I would advertise right in the like, what is it Program, like your musical theater program. And it'd be like you know, it's supported by Cameron Music and whatever I was going by for the like in-person stuff. Yeah. And then, Little by little, I would have students that said like I work with Chelsea Camon, blah, blah, blah, and I would have a few people in the school musical [00:21:00] that were also saying they're working with Chelsea Cam.

[00:21:01] Mm-hmm. What does that look like? It looks like Chelsea Camon knows what she's doing because Chelsea Camon is teaching all the leads Yeah. Of this, you know what I mean? So like slowly but surely at the, towards the end of my career there you know, people would be like, I heard you were doing this. I heard like, so you build buzz Yes.

[00:21:18] Just by like the kids loving you, which is, you know, like yeah. It's very easy to do that. And like also being good, but I think just like how I was personable with them and like able to do all that. But also, you know, that put me in a box too, was constricting in ways because I had to be a certain me again, to deliver the lessons to, you know, wealthy people in a wealthy area.

[00:21:43] You know, you have to look a certain way, I feel. Yeah. And you have to act a certain way. So it was just a lot of, I thought that I was just putting on my school teacher, you know, mask. And the reason why it all kind of came to light now is because [00:22:00] then I was just like working on, I had older people now asking me like people my age.

[00:22:04] Mm-hmm. And I was like, okay, I can't put on like the teacher to kid persona anymore cuz this is a friend. Yeah. And so my brain would literally like, kind of switch. Like I would have my own code switching. Mm-hmm. Like from, you know, one, one set of like being a teacher Yeah. To like, friend, it would be hard to transition.

[00:22:26] So if I was working with a friend, I was like really stiff and uptight and like mm-hmm. It just was weird. So I'm working on a masking so that I can weave in and out of both worlds. Right. So I was doing that and I was like, There's a secret third thing that is wrong with me, and I don't know why I'm like this.

[00:22:46] Like I truly didn't, I thought I was just like a performer. Yeah. And then I went into like autistic burnout. Mm-hmm. I thought it was just a total mental breakdown, but it was literally burnout. Mm-hmm. And I remember literally, Between sessions. Like I would be teaching, I'd be [00:23:00] like, okay, bye. I'll see you later.

[00:23:02] And, and I'd scream, I would literally scream, it got to two weeks where I was at my worst. Mm-hmm. And I'm so self-aware. I was like, I would tell my husband like, I'm having a mental breakdown. Mm. And it's like, I can see,

[00:23:17] Ashley: it's like, this doesn't look good for

[00:23:19] Chelsea: you. You don't have to tell me. I see it very clearly.

[00:23:23] So luckily I, yeah, I got, I got some medication after that and like, things have been on and up. Upturn, upswing, uphill. That's good. Not uphill. Yeah. Anyway, I don't know what you would say. Okay. Anyway, I get it.

[00:23:36] Ashley: A downhill It's been better. You managing

[00:23:39] Chelsea: it better? Yes. We're all managed symptoms are managed and now that I know I have autism, I'm able to manage my own like overwhelm and all that, which plays into the work that I do.

[00:23:49] So like, yeah, I like to help people. Especially neuro divergent people we're, a lot of us are very sensitive. Mm-hmm. And if you're anything like me, you're definitely, like, I, I [00:24:00] never got diagnosed or anything with like R s D or like rejection sensitive, but I'm sensitive. Mm-hmm. If a close friend of mine has a deferring opinion, I'm like, damn, that's it.

[00:24:09] It's over. Like,

[00:24:12] Ashley: you're like, everything. I just need to change everything about myself now.

[00:24:15] Chelsea: I'm like, oh no. Oh no. But it's also okay that like, they're, anyway, so that's fine. It's fine. I'm like, that's okay. But yeah. So like working now with more autistic people, more neuro divergent people, it is my audience to speak to because I know how hard it is to first show up for a voice lesson.

[00:24:36] Mm-hmm. That, that is. First of all, online for the first time there, there's a lot of parts to it. Mm-hmm. But then there's this component that's also I'm a healer. Yeah. So, so this is where it gets good. I was healing in, in the closet. I was a closet healer, closet witch, because I didn't want anyone to know, [00:25:00] I wanted to still come across as like this normal person mm-hmm.

[00:25:03] To these wealthy clients that I was serving. And because also, you know, it was like everybody goes to church, every, you know, like mm-hmm. You don't wanna be weird. You don't wanna be that one person that's like serving the public, asking for, you know, a decent fee. Mm-hmm. And then you know, being totally weird for them.

[00:25:23] Mm-hmm. And so when I just, before my husband and I got married I had always been wanting to study psychic work, things like that. Mm-hmm. And I posed the class, I was like, do you think I could take, it was like a really early on, like the first online classes that were coming out, right? Mm-hmm.

[00:25:40] Like 2012. Mm-hmm. This was like very new. Yeah. And it was an online community and I think I paid like $360 for this class. And it was like a lot for us at the time. Cause we were like 23. Yeah. Yeah. And I was like, woo, big spender. But it was this class and it was called Psychic, A Psychic Awakening course.

[00:25:59] And now I think it's [00:26:00] called Intuitive Awakening, but it was by this woman. Oh gosh, completely forget her name, but I see her face. She's like a New Zealander anyway it'll come to me and so I started working with her and I learned everything through this course. Mm-hmm. And also it was like on sale.

[00:26:19] It was a legitimate course. It sounds like a total, it was a real legitimate course with like a real good person. I'm, I can believe you. I'm like, $300 in 2012 was a lot. Okay. Oh yeah. It's a lot of money. And it was discounted, but I was like, I gotta get on this. Yeah. But yeah, so there was, I learned formally how to read tarot even though I'd been messing around with my cards for years.

[00:26:42] And so I had been formally learning tarot. Formally learning pendulum work. There was like just every kind of part of also like we would do picture gazing. What do you pick up from this person? What's their story? And we would just grow our psychic muscles [00:27:00] and then we would read for each other and our final was to like read one another.

[00:27:05] Through the pictures and we, you know, you can meet up if you're nearby and things like that. Yeah. Anyway, so I'd gone through this extensive training and then had kept working on it. I mean, I You learned everything from like binaural beats and like, just frequency? Yeah. It was really like, kind of like a crash course to everything.

[00:27:22] Mm-hmm. And so this opened a door for me, but I kind of kept studying it privately and not really, you know, sharing it with anyone. Again, I was still doing primarily voice teaching work. Mm-hmm. And then I, we had a house fire in 2015. Oh. It was a rental house. And we both weren't there, luckily. Mm-hmm.

[00:27:41] And this was way before our daughter. And that kind of catapulted me though, because after that fire, I was looking for holistic healing modalities. Mm-hmm. So I was looking into things like reiki and acupuncture and things like that. So I got into [00:28:00] reiki and then from there I learned I studied, you know, the first second like certifications for that modality.

[00:28:08] Yeah. And I offered it again just for friends. Mm-hmm. Nothing crazy. Like I was not charging anyone. I still wasn't super confident in my abilities. I really felt like I had to wait a little bit longer. But yeah, so I, I was attuned and all that and I was just providing it for friends and doing card readings for friends and that was always like on the side.

[00:28:30] Mm-hmm. And then come like 20, 20, 20 19, I started also like making like witchy bottles and selling it in stores and then the pandemic hit. Mm-hmm. And you know, I'm just feeling like kind of burned out, but like, it didn't get so bad until last year cuz I really was at capacity cuz I was growing my business.

[00:28:47] Mm-hmm. But yeah, like it just kind of like went one thing led to another. And so in the last couple years, like I'd offered spiritual mentorship and then I thought to [00:29:00] myself, well, What if a voice lesson just felt like a healing session? Mm-hmm. What would happen if I kind of combined that like, and let that be the way I.

[00:29:13] Help people. I still do reiki and I still do sound healing in person where I live now, I have clients that come here and Yetta and I do healing events once a month where she does reiki for everyone in the community. Mm-hmm. That shows up to the event and I play sound bowls. Mm-hmm. So like we work together with that too.

[00:29:33] And I have those things on the side, but my main focus online has been like getting more people to sing and realize like, this is a healing modality. Yes. Singing doesn't only, I think a lot of people think they should be taking voice lessons if they are a great singer or to become a great singer, but I think there's also somebody to be said about somebody that is willing to lead you Yeah.

[00:29:55] Regardless of your sound and won't judge you for [00:30:00] that. But is also not capitalizing on the fact that like, You might be, you know, very vulnerable and like, and you know, I think a lot of people think like, okay, if I'm paying for this service, I have to get better. Yeah. And I think the thing is the, the natural progression is that you will get better.

[00:30:18] Mm-hmm. Because it still is a muscle. Yeah. But I think a lot of people tend to think, oh, if you market to people that canceling like that, it's then vulnerable and, and like exploitive and mm-hmm. But it's not about that. It's about being the disabled person. Mm-hmm. Leading other people within that community looking for guidance and from a warm, natural, you know, source.

[00:30:42] Yeah. That's like there to actually help and be kind and not laugh at you or judge you for any sounds that you're making. Because we all make funny sounds like it's just like mm-hmm. And I think that it's stressful to also put that pressure on people that you have. Like I have so many singers that. Yes, Ken [00:31:00] Sing, but if they have, you know, a crack in their voice or the warmup doesn't sound great, I'm like, why are you making this like your Carnegie Hall debut for your warmup?

[00:31:09] Like, who cares? It's fine. I was like, just make a sound. Like make it happen. Like, yes, we want it to sound a certain way so that it doesn't hurt, but that, that should really be the number one. I think takeaway for lessons, like the first thing that teachers should really be checking for is, does this hurt?

[00:31:26] Yeah. Is this hurting you? Because I, you can make a sound that sounds great all day. You might be able to fool somebody, but you can't fool me and you might be able to fool somebody. I think a lot of people out there can like kind of scream and then the teacher's like, yeah. Get into it. Yeah. And I'm like, okay, but does

[00:31:44] Ashley: it hurt?

[00:31:45] Chelsea: Like what would we do now if we could? Actually open your throat, I don't know. Mm-hmm. And like we play around with that. So it's, it's a way that I can incorporate like my loving heart mm-hmm. Into a session because [00:32:00] I, I never could do it when a parent asked me, you know, okay, well they're prepping for, and I love audition perhaps.

[00:32:07] I love all that, but I, I hate the pressure of like, I have to be someone I'm not. Like they expected me to be Broadway vocal coach, and I have to have this severity and sincerity and just, you know, be really like severe and mm-hmm. I don't know, just I said that already, but like, just be very, you know, very uptight about things and I wanted it to be fun.

[00:32:28] Yeah. I wanted it to be more fun and really just a safer space for people because it just felt very like, I don't know, the old school way of, of teaching, which is like, if you don't get this now, you know? Mm-hmm. Like or we gotta keep working on this until it's perfect. And for me, I, I prioritize mental health and wellness over whether or not you're singing the song really, really well.

[00:32:55] Yeah. Or like, getting it done. Like my method is like if I see [00:33:00] somebody like basically banging their head against the wall with something, or like they, they feel like they're hitting a wall, I don't let them do it again. I tell them, change the mood. Pick a song that you sing really well. Yeah. Then they sound great, and then they realize you prove to yourself.

[00:33:14] Then like, oh, the other song's still in the learning process. That's why I kind of suck at singing it right now. Yeah. Because no one can really do things properly unless they really, really know it, you know? Mm-hmm. Any, anyone in the learning stage? If you're in the learning stage of social media, your post at first, like, oh yeah, you know, squeaky wheel, and then eventually like, it starts becoming a little bit more easy and you start putting out like things that feel very natural and fluent for you.

[00:33:42] Just like any other thing, you know, like doctors when there's training, they're like, I've never done surgery to brain surgery. Like that pipeline happens exactly. Over 16 years, but it happens. So I think it's very similar to singing in, I mean, aian surgery, but, you know. No, [00:34:00] I get what you're saying though, over time it definitely it definitely evolves and yeah, that's kind of like how I created like that holistic mm-hmm.

[00:34:09] Healing voice space. Because I just, I like that, like I've always started somebody's first lesson with Wow, it is really so courageous that you're here today. Yeah. Because it took so much courage for me to start my voice lessons. Because I was just always so afraid, I always had this fear that my voice teacher would judge me.

[00:34:28] Mm-hmm. Or that, you know, maybe I would find out I'm not good at all. Yeah. Maybe like, that would be my worst fear. Right. Whereas like, if in my, in the way I reframe things, it's like your worst fear is nothing because I don't even care if the sound isn't good or good, what is good? You know, like, yeah, yeah.

[00:34:46] I don't care. I wanna make sure that people are exploring their voices in a healthy way. Just like how a lot of people also say like, oh, I don't teach six year olds. I don't teach seven year olds. Like, they're too young. I'm like, yeah, but they're gonna sing anyway. And what [00:35:00] better person than a voice teacher to guide them through certain songs that they would like to sing.

[00:35:05] Yeah. You could give them accurate tools. So I, I, I do challenge kind of the, the norm and how people speak about who deserves voice lessons because mm-hmm. It's a very colonized. Thought process because we've been singing since before there were voice teachers. I think that's really, you know, important to note.

[00:35:24] Yeah. There had to be, you know, what came first, the chicken or the egg because there had to be someone to study what we were doing and say, okay, this is when we do this, it makes it better when we do this. It makes it worse. Like somebody had to analyze all that. And then somewhere along the line, we got this group, think of what voice lessons should be and what you should be singing and in systems.

[00:35:46] And it's just because people don't wanna breathe. Individuality. But that's a whole other, I could talk about the, I'm, I haven't stopped. I'm gonna breathe. I'm gonna

[00:35:55] Ashley: breathe. No, you didn't worry. Like

[00:35:58] Chelsea: you got, you probably got [00:36:00] questions.

[00:36:01] Ashley: This has been, this is so good. And actually it, it made me just think of what you were just saying.

[00:36:05] First of all, I love what you do because like you said before, singing can just be like something you just do because you wanna do it. It doesn't have to be. I wanna be a Broadway performer. You could just be like, I like singing so, right. I wanna try to learn how to do it better for myself. And I feel you're giving people such a good opportunity to do that.

[00:36:28] And you're not going in with like, oh, I'm gonna grill you and practice and you have to do it like this. I love that. And then it also made me think of, and I cannot remember the lady's name, but there is this indigenous woman on all the socials. She's very popular and she does this specific style of singing that's specific to Inuit people.

[00:36:48] Yes,

[00:36:49] Chelsea: yes. I've seen, yeah. Where they do like the throat breathing Yes. Throat. Yeah. Throat singing it. I know. Yes. I know. I wish I, yeah, it's

[00:36:55] Ashley: very cool. Yeah. So, but then I was reading an article about it and it was [00:37:00] seeing how it was banned up until, honestly, like, not that long ago, but it was banned when Canada was colonized because they were like, yes.

[00:37:07] Oh, it sounds like the devil. Yes. So we're gonna make everyone stop doing this. Mm-hmm. And like, just like you're saying, like that was their form of singing that made them, and she's saying now, like her doing it with her mom also. Yes. It's bringing, it's connecting her to her ancestors. It brings her closer to her culture.

[00:37:25] Yes. And it's like breathing more life into her culture by doing it. So it's like, man, like again,

[00:37:33] Chelsea: we're taking away Yes. People we're, we said it was bad.

[00:37:36] Ashley: These people said it was bad when for them it was, it was a form of fun. It was something that, yes, they expressed, it showed their culture. It's

[00:37:44] Chelsea: beautiful.

[00:37:45] And you don't have to just sing to like go on a Broadway stage. Mm-hmm. Like, it can be a form. I, I love, you know what side of TikTok I'm on when people are doing like working songs and they're like doing like of working songs. I just saw the, you know, where the, did [00:38:00] you see that one?

[00:38:00] Ashley: I think they were in

[00:38:01] Chelsea: Scotland or something.

[00:38:02] Yes, it was some group of like the old lady in the I know. And I'm just like, oh my God. Yes. Yes. And it's the same idea as like putting on that like hype playlist to just get the laundry done. Yes. Yes. It's gotta be the right one. Like this is me folding things I like flailing my arms in case you're just listening.

[00:38:24] I'm just flailing my arms. I do folding. There's so much that music helps us with. And so, and I like to explore that and that's why I'm also a sound healer. Mm-hmm. And I like to explore my own voice when I'm sound healing. The other day we had a healing event and I just, I like to channel, you know, the melodies that come through and everything.

[00:38:44] And I looked at yet and I'm like, Should I sing? Like, I'm like miming to her while she's like, mm-hmm. Like raking everybody. And we're both like, we both came to the agreement like, no, no, not today, not today. But I just wanted to see how she was feeling about it too. But I just felt like [00:39:00] everyone was really in a zone moment, and it would just be like, like rattling everybody.

[00:39:04] I was like, ha, like, you know, it's too much. I'm just trying to teach people how to meditate. You don't have to make this your stage, Chelsea. You know, like I try to also like say, like, does my ego wanna sing right now or does it feel immersive in healing? But yeah, like, so I'm, I'm just totally, I, I'm so immersed in music and sound, and I love how each culture and person uses music to amplify their own uniqueness.

[00:39:33] Yes. So that's why I also don't subscribe to like this method. Is gonna help you sound like this person. I don't want anyone to sound like anyone else but themselves. Mm-hmm. And like, the last thing I've ever wanted is somebody to go to a recital studio of mine when I was working in New York and listen to and be like, that's great, but they all sound like Chelsea.

[00:39:55] Yeah. That would be so embarrassing. But instead, I would acquire students [00:40:00] that were singer songwriters, so they loved to have like a different kind of sound than the pop star. Mm-hmm. Than the musical theater kid. And yet I was working with all of them because I've had, I have ample experience through all genres, but they could all come to me because they knew I wasn't going to change them.

[00:40:17] I was going to only like give them the technique to amplify what they already do. Yeah. So I actually have a student right now, she's, she's in London for songwriting. Oh, neat. And she she goes to college. Yeah. She was my student years ago, but we still keep in touch. But yeah, like she's, she's out there doing that and like, Her technique has evolved so much.

[00:40:37] But she sounds so different than another student of mine who's off to college for musical theater and like just two widely wildly different voices. And yet I'm their sa I'm the same teacher, but it doesn't even sound like they have the same technique. Yes. Which is like really key for me. And, and that's also, I think, you know, you can fall into that when you're a classical singer.

[00:40:58] A lot of people do [00:41:00] start to sound the same because classical technique is, is you know, very like I use a lot of classical components that are the foundations. Mm-hmm. For sure. Mm-hmm. But it's not just classical, it's just like proper technique, which is like your tongue is relaxed, your teeth are apart, your soft pallet's lifted.

[00:41:18] It's basically like, how can I make this the best little acoustic room that I can in here? Yes. Yes. And that's how I break it down for people, because think about if you're in an echoy room and the, you know, the roof is really, really high. That's the same thing your mouth is doing when you lift the soft palette, which for anybody that doesn't know, and this is so important and I'm dying with the divine.

[00:41:39] Mm-hmm. Do you like how I have to like make this really, I do this during lessons too. I like, like I'll be like plot twist. I come close to the mic, I'm like, yes for this. And everybody sees me doing it. I'm like, it's my bit now. Okay. It's a part of an autistic girl needs bits, so she has things to hold [00:42:00] onto to make her funny so that she just doesn't dissociate in front of you like,

[00:42:07] Anyway. I love you. You're doing great. I need you every week in my life laughing at all my jokes. Oh my God. This brings me back to my therapy sessions, which isn't supposed to be funny either, but she, she would say, had good material. You're hilarious. Thank you. Yes. Only with only, only with people that receive me well, like if there are other people, probably neurotypical, typical people.

[00:42:33] I'm sorry, Ashley, you're probably neuro I've diagnosed you. It's literally

[00:42:38] Ashley: not a problem. And also I feel the same way. Some people, they'll just look at me like, what? I'm just like, oh, oh God, you find this funny? I'm being weird again.

[00:42:47] Chelsea: Oh God, I'm doing it again. I know. It's like because I'm unmasking. It's like, oh my God, I'm seventh grade me again.

[00:42:54] I feel like a oozy blob of like puberty right now. I don't know why, because I'm [00:43:00] just like, I'm like, oh my God, this is why my friends used to call me scratch from Ice Age, if you are familiar with that 2001 Classics Ice Age. We went to the movies in seventh grade and my, all my friends were like, scratch you.

[00:43:17] And I'm like, thank you. I mean, scrap what? So, so what I got out of that was like, okay, I'm hyperactive, but also am I like the star of the show? Yeah. I might be. I might be. I might be a little bit, they were definitely saying it like as you're an idiot, like this thing. But I loved it. I kind of liked being that role as a kid.

[00:43:39] Like I thought it was so funny to be the wacky, yeah, like quirky. I loved it, but then somewhere along the line I was like, oh God, this is so unseemly. Yes, I must, I must just like balayage my hair and not be seen and like be as thin as possible and like just, you know, the. [00:44:00] It just, oh yeah. It screams, it screams colonialism,

[00:44:04] Ashley: baby.

[00:44:04] Ooh. I remember going to college and thinking like, I have to be normal now. Like, yes. I have to work really hard. Like, prep

[00:44:12] Chelsea: yourself. Yes. Prep yourself. I'm gonna wear cardigans. I know. I,

[00:44:16] Ashley: I, oh, I'm gonna wear for, I, I like cardigans. But you know what I used to do? This is so weird. This is audio. But I used to like flail my arms around my friends, cuz I thought it was hilarious.

[00:44:27] I would just walk up to them and be like, and then I realized, like in college, I was like, oh, these people don't, they don't like people that, oh,

[00:44:36] Chelsea: you're not flail.

[00:44:38] Ashley: You guys don't think, okay, this is not fun. Okay, I gotta, okay, I gotta, oh, I gotta go to a party and act. Cool. Oh, it

[00:44:45] Chelsea: was only fun the first time.

[00:44:46] Okay. Right. So then what do we do? Like, we don't realize at the time it's like selective mutism in ways that we're just like, I would feel like just a tenseness in my body. And this is also why I got got down the whole [00:45:00] spiritual path because I felt so weird. Mm-hmm. And I'm like, maybe there's something that can explain it.

[00:45:06] And so people always told me as a kid, you're an old soul, you're different, you're quirky. Mm-hmm. And then it's funny as I start to like unmask and realize like, oh God, I have this. Yeah. My, my, my parents were like, no, you don't. I'm like, oh, that's because, sweetie, you do too.

[00:45:23] Ashley: Like

[00:45:25] Chelsea: I to break it to you, do you remember used to sing, like they would sing like commercials from the sixties just as a stem?

[00:45:35] Clearly. Not just because they're just like fun, happy sixties. Commercial lovers. Like that's weird

[00:45:42] Ashley: too. Why are, cause I do things like this all the time. Cause

[00:45:49] Chelsea: Ashley, there's a deeper truth. I need you to title this podcast. The podcast. I realize I have autism like, like please. And the thing is, what's not nice is to tell somebody like, I think you have [00:46:00] autism, right?

[00:46:00] Which apparently that's not nice, but like,

[00:46:04] Ashley: I'm not offended. So people,

[00:46:07] Chelsea: right? Well, autistic people receive it and go, oh, I know that could be what's going on with me. But people who aren't autistic go like, You think I'm slow? Like they really get offended. Like there are people that, right. Yeah. And I'm like, oh my God.

[00:46:21] It's not a slow, it's not an intellectual disability alone. Yeah. You can have a comorbidity of intellectual disability. Mm-hmm. But the only thing I can't do sometimes is like, make food or like process a really big emotion or Yes. You know, like, I'm like, I'm crying immediately. Somebody's mad at me. I'm like, I'm

[00:46:37] Ashley: sorry.

[00:46:38] I think that part of it is too, like, so my fiance actually, he works with a lot of. Autistic adults, but they're, and I don't wanna say anything wrong, but like, they're at a

[00:46:49] Chelsea: different function, like high, high support needs.

[00:46:51] Ashley: Okay. Yes. That's okay. Yes, it's okay. Yeah. I just don't wanna say the wrong thing, but like, I know it's okay.

[00:46:56] So they're at like a different level, so like mm-hmm. I think even [00:47:00] me, like, that's what I'm used to seeing. So when I think of, of course, autism, yes. I think of that,

[00:47:05] Chelsea: that, and that's the problem. I think a lot of us have seen really just like high support needs. And, and of course high support needs autistic individuals are going to be the.

[00:47:17] Thing that we focus on because that's the thing we're trying to help. Yeah. We're trying to do quotes. Yeah. Yeah, yeah. Yeah. That's the thing we're trying to help. Right. But we, we are now coming to realize like, okay, people with autism might need support. They, but it, it's incurable. Mm-hmm. It's not something we're, we're here to cure.

[00:47:35] And as somebody who was always, by the way, like hyper focused on like this, nothing tells you you're more freaking different when you're like, you have to tell yourself to be normal. Oh yeah. Or like, it's, it's like that's

[00:47:49] Ashley: don't anything weird. That's why I used say time. Yeah.

[00:47:52] Chelsea: How telling is that? Normal people don't say be normal.

[00:47:56] And I, I literally put myself to bed laughing [00:48:00] the other night cuz I'm like just queuing through my little Rolodex in my brain and I'm like, What's the most autistic thing I do? Oh, the most autistic thing I do is act

[00:48:10] Ashley: normal. Try to just

[00:48:13] Chelsea: stay still and like people don't realize that that was my backstory.

[00:48:17] That was, that's what was happening in my brain 24 7. Even sleeping now. But like people, you know, just don't know what's going on in your mind. And though I am low support needs. Mm-hmm. But it, it's like I have support needs as far as like, okay, I know now I probably need like a weighted blanket. Mm-hmm.

[00:48:37] Like I have more like the sensory issues and the overwhelm. So like certain foods are a problem, like certain like foods can be safe foods. Again, never thought it was a safe food. Just thought, oh, I like this because I'm not feeling well. Oh my God. It's like you're,

[00:48:53] Ashley: I know, I just remember something.

[00:48:55] Sorry. I like, or Ashley,

[00:48:56] Chelsea: Ashley and I are gonna talk after this. She's gonna be like

[00:48:59] Ashley: my, my [00:49:00] sister's favorite thing to like, Joke about the fact that I say all the time is I have consistency issues. I say it all the time. I'm like, there's certain things I'm like, oh, I can't eat that. I can't eat that. If I put in my mouth, I'm gonna throw up.

[00:49:10] Yes.

[00:49:11] Chelsea: Because just the feel

[00:49:13] Ashley: of it. Yeah. I know. Like I have a weird thing with yogurt. I can only eat Greek yogurt, but regular yogurt, I can, I use force myself to try to eat it. Cause I want to be normal. Yes. And then I, but if I eat it, I'm like,

[00:49:26] Chelsea: I felt that way. I felt that way about macaroni salad you take in from like, okay, I get it.

[00:49:31] You know? Yeah. Because, and then I'm just like, and then some people's macaroni salad is just like tany mayo. Yeah. And I'm like, this isn't good. Are we collectively liking this? And I, every, every like cookout, I'd be like, okay, I'm like trying to like this. Yeah. And it's just not, and I would try, I was literally trying to force myself to like it.

[00:49:54] I'm like, if I put it on the plate and I just, Desensitize myself. Yes. Every time. Which again, is a very [00:50:00] normal

[00:50:00] Ashley: thing you do. Yes. I try so hard. The only thing I actually worked that I did do was avocados. I like avocados now and I like force myself to like them. Oh. Oh, it worked for you. That's the only thing.

[00:50:12] But other than that, do you see that? Like

[00:50:14] Chelsea: we're developing systems to like things and that's, that's probably a pro what most Yeah. No, I'm sorry. I don't mean to keep, no, I can't wait till we have this conversation cause it's gonna be great.

[00:50:26] Ashley: I really, really thought that other people, I love you so much for making me realize this.

[00:50:31] Like I really do go into, even I'm 30, almost 35. I'm like going into situations to be like, all right, don't say anything weird to make people think you're strange. Oh my God, Ashley, please. Please. That's right. For once in your life.

[00:50:46] Chelsea: Yes. I literally just walked into the the town hall that I had to like get the key from for the event.

[00:50:53] Mm-hmm. And my whole routine of like who I first see changed. And so somebody was like, [00:51:00] hi, what are you here for? I'm like, I. Janet Key event scared.

[00:51:06] Ashley: You get just nervous, right? I'm like,

[00:51:09] Chelsea: I'm, I immediately am sweating like immediately, like my back is just pouring. I'm like, why am I like this? And I just thought I had like anxiety.

[00:51:17] Yeah. And social anxiety. So like having all these sensitivities like made me a very different voice

[00:51:24] Ashley: teacher. We're getting back. Everybody. We're

[00:51:28] Chelsea: circling back. I'm trying,

[00:51:30] Ashley: I'm trying. This has been the best conversation. I know.

[00:51:33] Chelsea: This is amazing. I, this is the best Saturday I am. Whether or not we aired on a Saturday.

[00:51:40] Sorry, this is Yetta does the same thing. She's like, happy Friday. And I'm like, it's Wednesday.

[00:51:48] Ashley: It's a Wednesday.

[00:51:50] Chelsea: We've done that a couple times. That's no problem. I know, I know. But yeah, like I have always been very different. And so I knew that like, as long as I could get in with the cool [00:52:00] different kids that worked for me.

[00:52:02] And then the adults came and then those people were a little different because I can spot a really weird theater kid a mile away. The adults, again, we are all masking and trying to look normal

[00:52:12] Ashley: or Yes. I so yeah. I'm sorry. I don't mean to interrupt you. Yeah, you're not interrupting me. I'm sorry. I. Okay.

[00:52:19] I say this all the time, I'm just assuming that everyone else is masking because I used to say, I'm like, why did we get older? And everybody just acts like this. Like I've said this a million times. Like, cuz I think of people I've known throughout my life and like, yes, even if they weren't wild or anything when we were kids, but I'm just like, so you just grew up and you just changed.

[00:52:39] Now you just act like you're proper and Oh, so you're a mom now so you act like you never got drunk in my backseat and threw up. Like, what are we doing?

[00:52:48] Chelsea: Right. Well, I thought that there had to be a distinct change of personality.

[00:52:53] Ashley: Me too. My whole life. Oh, Chelsea, I swear to God. I, my whole life I'm like, , I'm not changing [00:53:00] like I've seen.

[00:53:02] Chelsea: And so now I'm like, okay, like in every day now that I'm on masking, I'm like, how can I. Like, show my inner child again. Mm-hmm. Because that's who I really am. Yeah. And like, you know, cuz so sometimes when I like, catch myself being like snarky or like hating on something, I'm like, Ew, that's a trauma response.

[00:53:23] You stop that right now. Yes. That's a like, no, you were taught that by mean girls. Mm-hmm. And so certain things I'm like, wait, why do I even think that at all? This person is lovely. Like, why did I even think that They were like, just this whole, it's, it's mind boggling because there's so many things that we're trained to be like mm-hmm.

[00:53:42] That we really aren't because kids are all like, really pretty good. Mm-hmm. Like pre, pre pre-K, like LO's three and four year olds. Mm-hmm. They're all sweet except there's one kid that's got a bad attitude. I said, you stick your tongue one more time out on my kid, we're gonna [00:54:00] fight. I, no, but like at the, I saw him making a face at her and I was like, Stop that and like my daughter's just like,

[00:54:10] Ashley: oh, I have almost fought a 12 year old over my sister.

[00:54:13] And I would do it again. Anytime, any day I will fight a kid.

[00:54:17] Chelsea: Yes, yes, yes. I used to literally get demerits like for a couple years in a row as a kid because my friends would come up to me and be like, I'm having a problem with this dude over here. And I'd be like, fourth grade, like, I know, here we go.

[00:54:29] I'd go, okay, over by the yard. And otherwise I was like a really good kid. Mm-hmm. And like very smart. Good at school. But like then I was, had this violent streak again. Because I was autistic. Yeah, right. So there's a sense of justice and this sense of like anger for people that are getting hurt. Mm-hmm. I didn't just wanna hurt people.

[00:54:49] Like, I was just like, hey. And then like, I just like beat a kid up one time and like everybody was like, what the fuck? Like, Chelsea just beat up this boy and won. Like, [00:55:00] I'm like, you don't? And like, I got him bleeding. Like it was bad. Oh my God. Like I was, I scratched him. No, I'm not proud of this moment. I was also like, oh, it's okay.

[00:55:08] Eight,

[00:55:08] Ashley: eight. But yeah, everybody lived. It's fine.

[00:55:11] Chelsea: Yeah, everybody lived. I don't know. But that kid, like, that kid was scared of me. Then it was, and I was like, and then my mom every year before school would be like, we're not gonna get married this year. Right. We're gonna, we're gonna not hit people. And like, I was just a rough rider.

[00:55:30] Ashley: Your, your rado was don't start no shit. Won't be no shit. Right? I wanna be friends with everybody and be cool with everyone, but if you're gonna start with me, I'm gonna have, have to scratch you. I needed,

[00:55:40] Chelsea: I needed justice. I didn't mean to make him bleed. I feel bad,

[00:55:46] Ashley: Sam. It's okay. He's out there. It's okay.

[00:55:49] It's still, he's out there.

[00:55:51] Chelsea: He's out there. I don't know what his, I don't even know what his name was, to be honest, which is sick. Like that's how much I cared and I didn't even know him. Okay. [00:56:00] Anyway, people that like voice teachers that beat up kids.

[00:56:05] Ashley: See Chelsea, the voice witch

[00:56:09] Chelsea: because I, I, it's just, I just care so much.

[00:56:12] Oh God. I just care so

[00:56:13] Ashley: much. Chelsea. I can't, you're killing me. You're killing me right now. Oh my God. We're gonna, I'm gonna, we're gonna talk really quick about our dish. Yeah. Of the week. Okay. Our dish of the week. Let's do this. God. So sorry. No, do not be sorry. This is amazing. I just feel like, oh, I guess I have to talk about other fig.

[00:56:32] Dammit. I love it. I'm here for it all. Oh God. This has been amazing. Okay. So instead of having a dish this week, I was like, this is what we're gonna do. Cuz you're from Long Island, right? Yeah. And you went to Columbia born and raised. Yes. Yeah. In the city. Yes. Okay. So I am city adjacent. I live in New Jersey, so I'm familiar with the city.

[00:56:53] Yes. And I grow there quite often. So we're gonna just pull, I pulled up some quick, cheap New York [00:57:00] eats. Cause sometimes we don't need to cook all the time. Sometimes we can go get something to eat. So I'm just gonna read a couple of 'em. I find out cool article, I'll put the link in the show notes. So this is, let's see what we could get for cheap because New York's, if you guys don't live in New York, it's expensive.

[00:57:14] That's why I'm in Indiana now. You said I gotta get outta here. I am. It's even like a studio apartment in New York. Like a, a crappy studio apartment. Now it's almost $3,000 a month. It's wildly, but I love New York City in general just cuz it's, it's fun. It's just, it's a fun place. There's,

[00:57:35] Chelsea: there's a vibe there.

[00:57:36] There's definitely an unbeatable

[00:57:38] Ashley: buzz. Yes. It's like, I don't know. It's like nowhere else, at least that I've been yet, so, yeah. All right. So there's some places, I don't think I've heard of any of these places, but it don't matter. Okay. Pretend exactly. So guys, you could go to little Rows in the East Village and, oh no, it's called Unapologetic Foods [00:58:00] and the place is, the dish is called a rowdy rooster.

[00:58:03] Looks like a very delicious chicken kind of sandwich. Nice. Okay. Then we could go for kimchi. Beer cheese. Ooh, what's that? I don't know, but you can get it at the Good Fork Pub. That's fun. And we got a $7 breakfast. That's pretty good. In the East Village at b and h Dairy. Wow.

[00:58:25] Chelsea: Well, dang. I know Lillian Luz is also this like upscale.

[00:58:29] I'm now I'm like, oh, I don't know if I can add these things. Of course you can. That's the whole point. Go ahead. On Lexington Avenue, this place, Lil and Luz. Hmm. It was, it's this PanAsian restaurant, but the best thing was they had gluten free sesame chicken. Mm-hmm. And that was next level for me because like I wasn't able to have that.

[00:58:50] And this was also when I was eating meat. I'm not eating meat anymore. Oh. But it's just because of like dietary, like needs. Mm-hmm. Because I'm sickly. But it's fine. And it's also [00:59:00] a textural issue. Like who likes beef?

[00:59:02] Ashley: Yeah. Especially ground beef is kind of weird. It's another thing I force myself to eat.

[00:59:06] Sometimes I'm

[00:59:07] Chelsea: struggling, I struggle with meat. Mm-hmm. I struggle with it. Even when I was a kid, I was just eating rice like for dinner. I'm like, this is my malnutrition. Find me. But yeah, Lill and lose, you can get some gluten free things. Where else do we go? There's, there's oh my God. This, this like, what do you call it?

[00:59:23] Hello Diner. Oh, like a halal diner? Yeah. Yeah. It's a, there's a D diner on it was called Green Kitchen. Mm-hmm. East 76, I think. And first, Something like that. Don't know if I'm, if I have the avenue right at all, but East 76 is called Green Kitchen. We would get like, they do every kind of food really?

[00:59:43] Well. It's like surprising. Mm-hmm. You, you're like, I want guacamole. And they're like, here you go. And then you're like, I would like link weenie with like a clam sauce. And they're like, here you go. And like, both were good. So then we would just get confused. But those were like our, our top ones and yeah.[01:00:00]

[01:00:00] Mm-hmm. But yeah. Oh my God, the food in New York is so delicious. But where I'm at now in Fort Wayne, there's a downtown. Mm-hmm. Because it's technically a city. It's the second smallest city in Fort Wayne next to Indie Indianapolis. Okay. So it's like Indianapolis and then us. Mm-hmm. So they're, they're trying to, I mean, they're gentrifying it.

[01:00:19] Mm-hmm. But it's. We'll call it what it is. Sorry. What are you gonna do? It's really what's happening because like who's coming in New Yorkers are mm-hmm. Are buying, you know, like are coming in to, to, you know, have a cheaper place to live. Mm-hmm. And yeah. Anyway there's a lot of food in, in Fort Wayne and there's actually an account, Fort Wayne Food Slut.

[01:00:39] It's a girl from Fort Wayne. Person from Fort Wayne. I know she's doing the Lord's work though, because she puts, she puts food you can actually eat in Fort Wayne. That's good and fun. And, and like all that, which, like, when you're first here you're like, oh my God, it's just corn fields. And, and then you get into the town and then I'm like, okay, this is like a mini, this is like Long [01:01:00] Island.

[01:01:00] This is exact, I can do this. I'm gonna, but then you can literally be in farm area. Yeah. Yeah.

[01:01:05] Ashley: I'm gonna find her. And I will put that in the show notes too, cuz that's fun. Fort Wayne Foods there's a place, I think it's in Harlem, It's called the Red Rooster. I ate there once. It was very good. I believe you.

[01:01:18] Yeah, it was very good. It was very good. I know. Yeah, that's, I like the way you said that. It was very good. And I don't know, every time I, oh, and also you can get good, well, you have to be careful, but you can get good food at like the whole all street cart. But you just have to be careful with the street cart.

[01:01:34] Cause just like, make sure it looks all right because sometimes it looks a little sketch. Sketch. That's no problem. Don't eat that one. Go to the next one. They're on every corner. Especially if you're in Manhattan, you'll find it. Yeah.

[01:01:44] Chelsea: You'll know the good ones because they will be more packed.

[01:01:48] Ashley: Yes. The one that has the line.

[01:01:49] Mm-hmm.

[01:01:50] Chelsea: Yep. So go to the line, go to the place that has the line. Don't get it when it has the line, but go to it on it's off hour. Yes. The next, the hour later. Yeah. Make note. Be like, [01:02:00] okay.

[01:02:00] Ashley: This one on this one. 76. Okay. Yes. All right. Yeah, so that's our food today guys. Cause I was like, girl, I don't know what to do with this food today.

[01:02:08] So I was like, New York, that's great. New York, anywhere you go it's the food is good. So this is a part of the show where I plug myself. So if you guys like this show, if you like hearing us Chitty chat, cuz that's fun, I'm having a great time. Pause it right now and you can go and follow, subscribe and give us a five star rating if you like, on whatever platform you listen to us.

[01:02:27] And if you have any suggestions for episodes or any comments, you know, just be cool about it. Okay? But you feel like if you have comments or critiques you can email me at dine with the divine pod gmail.com and then you can follow us at Dine With a Divine on Instagram or and also on Facebook.

[01:02:45] My Facebook page looks a little crazy cuz I just made it the other day. I gotta fix it. But don't worry about it. Everybody just, just go. So anyway, let's move on. So the next, the next thing. And we'll go through this. We don't have to go through, cuz we talked a lot about this singing, but I just thought this was a fun [01:03:00] list to talk about.

[01:03:00] So number one, we're talking about singing. So I looked up and I was like, what's the history of singing? That's pretty big, but it doesn't matter. I still looked it up. And one thing they said that I thought was interesting was, linguists and everybody , why do people sing it all? Like, what happened do you think one day some, like, some Neanderthal guy was like doing hunting and gathering and he was like, huh?

[01:03:19] And he was like, huh, that's, that's a sound. That's huh. He's like, oh, oh, right. Excuse me, me. But so there's a couple theories. So one of the theories they say was, This one they said is probably not true. And I think it's dumb. They're like, oh, it was a mating call. It's how people found you. I'm like, no.

[01:03:36] People were banging to just bang cuz that's what people like to do. What do they need a mating call for? Yeah. Right. That's dumb. So I don't believe that one. And

[01:03:44] Chelsea: most people were not like calling like they were close by

[01:03:49] Ashley: and that's, they were like, Hey, you wanna bang? Another person was like, all right.

[01:03:53] And then they banged wasn't that serious. And then the other one, they say it rose with the development of language, [01:04:00] which could make sense, you know? And then also this other person said there's a couple different things they think they needed it. Number one, we kind of talked about like those work songs mm-hmm.

[01:04:10] That were like making stuff less boring to do mm-hmm. That they had to do. Some places. And actually, okay, this makes sense to improve the ease and range of long distance communication. There is a village, a very specific village, I don't know the name of it in Turkey. Where they have this specific method of calling each other through like specific whistles.

[01:04:33] It's very cool. It's like its own language, but that's how they like, that's so Yes. Enticing. It's so cool. I have to find it. And they, because the area I think is quite mountainous, so it just would like echo. So they would just be like, the other person would be like, oh, okay, yeah, you want me to co for dinner six, I'm coming.

[01:04:52] Like, it was cool. Yes. That is so cool. I have to look that up now. Yes. I'm definitely gonna look it up cuz I, I know I've seen several videos about it [01:05:00] and then some people said to one, another reason may to enhance their communication with the divine or the supernatural. Yeah. Makes sense. To assist in coordination, cohesion, and cooperation of families and communities.

[01:05:13] Mm-hmm. Makes sense. And then some people said maybe a means to frighten off predators or enemies or something like that. I said maybe, I don't know. That's, that's,

[01:05:23] Chelsea: So funny to me thinking about it like, Hey, way Big bear,

[01:05:29] Ashley: goodbye. But then I think of that in a terms, so not singing, but dance. Right? I think of like haka dancing.

[01:05:38] Yes. Yes. Oh my God, I, yes. It's so cool. Right? I get chills every time I watch dance. Like I could just watch videos for hours. Yes. So, That's part of the reason they think singing came about. So then I found another article, which was fun. It was about what are the benefits of singing some, there's like a lot of benefits.

[01:05:54] Yes, yes. We talked about stimulates the vagus nerve. Ooh, yes. That's in here, right? Mm-hmm. Stimulates the vagus nerve.[01:06:00] It actually can help increase pain thresholds. I heard. Tell me how, okay, so here it says, when you sing in a group, my or a large choir, small the collective singing causes your body to relief and release and endorphins.

[01:06:14] Yes. Yes. And this hormone can produce positive feelings and change your perception of pain. Yes. The,

[01:06:19] Chelsea: I didn't know about changing the perception of pain, but I do know it there is a collective like magic that does happen. Mm-hmm. Because you are releasing the endorphins. And then what happens is also if you're in like a chorus, you're releasing those endorphins and you're next to that person, they're also releasing the endorphins and you are also.

[01:06:37] Making this music that is to communicate. Mm-hmm. There is something that's like a much bigger feeling that is incorporated and that is also like, it, it opens up a portal, I believe, for like connecting with the other side. Mm-hmm. With the divine and with our own higher selves. And I think there's like a magic to it that happens.

[01:06:55] Yes. And I think that's why people feel so compelled to also like, like sing in choirs. Mm-hmm. [01:07:00] Because it really does feel good. But it also improves like your breathing. You

[01:07:04] Ashley: have the article. Yes. I'm sure you have the mark. Oh yeah. Oh yeah. It, it, it, okay. One thing it says it may improve snoring, which I thought, Ooh.

[01:07:13] I'm like, that could be, yeah. Yeah. I'm like, I gotta, I sing all the time though, and my fiancee says I snore loud, but whatever. And okay, you already said this improves long function. So it can help with different conditions. C O P D, asthma, right. Cystic fibrosis. And then another one we got brings, oh, this one is kind of, we talked a lot about this bringing a sense of belonging, connection.

[01:07:34] Yeah. Yeah. Really helping people feel It does. Yeah. Like they're more part of something and something could be the greater beyond. It could be a group. Mm-hmm. Whatever, you know, makes you feel and Okay. This one I also knew enhances memory in people with dementia. Well,

[01:07:50] Chelsea: yeah, I Have you seen that One woman, she has dementia and yet every time they're like, play this piano song that you knew in like [01:08:00] 1970s.

[01:08:00] She could say, play perfect. And she goes, I don't know it. And then she goes to the piano. Did it? Did it? Yes. Oh my God. It's because her muscle memory. Some, somewhere in the back of the mind, she remembered it. Mm-hmm. With my grandfather, he, he had dementia at the end of his life. Mm-hmm. And didn't really know who I was, knew I must have been family.

[01:08:22] Mm-hmm. He had that memory, like that knowledge knowing that family was visiting him mm-hmm. But didn't know necessarily who was in the end. Mm-hmm. And he loved listening to old music, Eddie Fisher, like really old stuff. And we would listen to that. He was literally just floored. So happy would be like, ha just like, enjoying life, you know?

[01:08:46] Yeah. And there's like lyrics, like he, he would remember things that he would know. Mm-hmm. And like what, what's, what is that? Why can't the brain remember their child of X amount of years, [01:09:00] but then can go into elaborate song? I know it's very, very interesting

[01:09:06] Ashley: how it's so interesting. They have and I think, I think in terms of , not singing, but music.

[01:09:12] There's another video I found one day and it was so cool. I think this woman, I think she was French and she's over the age of a hundred. I'm not sure how old she was, but she had dementia as, and she used to be like a principal ballerina for a company. As soon as they put on like the main song for Swan Lake, this woman couldn't really walk.

[01:09:32] She was in a wheelchair. She was like, like she put her, she was doing the whole movement. Wow. And they played, like, they played the video of her. Dancing next to her, her side by side. Yeah. And you could see she was actually doing all the fingers and the, it was, she immediately remembered how to do it.

[01:09:49] It was so cool to watch. And like, she was like, oh, it was beautiful. I got chills. It was awesome. So another one, it helps with grief. This is, this is really [01:10:00] random, but I listen to random music. I listen to a lot of music. There is this group called Laboratorium Pen Piny. I'm not saying it right. It's a Polish group.

[01:10:11] And they made a whole album of funeral songs like that. People in like different Slavi cultures would sing cuz they would have like a vigil overnight. Sure. Like, you know, different cultures do that. Yeah. And they would sing specific songs while like, they would have a vigil with like sometimes the body there.

[01:10:31] And all the women would sing these songs to like get through the night. And they made a whole album of it and it was kind of cool. Yeah. Just to like listen to them. And they do that. You're gonna know what it's called and I'm gonna say it wrong. Is it polyphonic singing? Where they Yeah. Yeah. Where they like all sing like I don't know how to explain it, but yeah.

[01:10:51] All,

[01:10:52] Chelsea: yep, yep, yep, yep, yep, yep. It's very cool. Yes. It's, it's that all parts are together.

[01:10:56] Ashley: Yes. Yes. Yeah. It's, oh yeah. I love that kind of singing. I'm like obsessed with [01:11:00] it. Yes. And then it helps, and I know this from my last job not my last job, but a job I used to have, I used to work in like an acute rehab, so we get a lot of people at strokes, mm-hmm.

[01:11:09] And our speech therapist would sing with them because she said that singing helps. You can usually sing before you can speak. So a lot of them who lost parts of their speech, it helped them a lot when they could sing the words instead of happening to say them. Cuz it was much easier. Yeah. So yeah, so, so cool.

[01:11:28] Yes. Singing improves the ability, speechy ability with people with autism, Parkinson's disease, aphasia, following a stroke, and a lot of people have, do have stuttering. Mm-hmm. Apparently can help them too. Yeah. So,

[01:11:39] Chelsea: yes, a lot of people who stutter, if you have them sing a song, they don't stutter through the song because they already know the words.

[01:11:46] Mm-hmm. They already know the melody. A lot of times stuttering happens because they don't know necessarily what they're going to say next. So it becomes That

[01:11:56] Ashley: makes sense. A disability. Yeah. Interesting so, [01:12:00] okay, so that's you guys. Some of the benefits of singing, it's amazing. And if you want a singing lesson, definitely go to Chelsea because she's she's not good judge you. She's gonna be like, girl, let's go.

[01:12:09] So now it's gonna be story time. I'm gonna tell you a story about somebody who, when I, the more I learned about you, it kind of reminded me of her story cuz this person was doing something very different and. People were looking at her cock eyed like, girl, what are you doing? Mm-hmm. So I thought it would be fun to tell this story.

[01:12:29] Okay. Yeah. So here we go. So we're gonna tell the story today of Sister Rosetta Thorpe. Have you ever heard of her? No. All right. It's gonna be fun. I don't think I, yeah. Oh yeah. It's gonna be fun. Don't worry. So, sister Rosetta Thorpe, she was born March 20th, 1915 in cotton plant, Arkansas. So her parents were cotton pickers in Arkansas, and her family was pretty religious.

[01:12:52] They were part of a church called the Church of God in Christ. So they went to church every Sunday, very, very religious. I think her dad, I didn't write this down, [01:13:00] but I think her dad played an instrument, and then her mom sang in the church. So they brought her to church because they realized, okay, she could kind of sing.

[01:13:07] So they brought her into the church and she was doing it singing the choir. But then they gave her a guitar when she was six. And like within months, They were like, damn Rosetta, you can do everything. So mm-hmm. They called her little Rosetta Newin and she was cute. Ooh. Yeah. So she was so good that her mom and her went to Chicago and they would travel with a group to different churches singing cuz she was that good.

[01:13:30] So she became known as a guitar prodigy throughout all these groups. And by the age of 19 she went and married a preacher named Thomas Sarp and he was part of the Church of God in Christ. But she left him a few years later cuz he sucked and he was like abusive and I think he was cheating on her a whole bunch of times.

[01:13:48] So she was like, nevermind. So she, so she left him and then she moved to New York with her mom. Now speaking of masking, this sister Rosetta was doing a lot of [01:14:00] that in her own way. So she , you know, she got married to this dude cuz that's what she was supposed to do. She was singing gospel music cuz that's what she was supposed to do, but, And, I posted a, a video in the show notes too.

[01:14:12] When you see this woman sing, it's like she's possessed by some other worldly spirit. Ooh, it's so cool. Like, I have to check this out. Oh, yeah. And she's a very unique voice, so it's very, very neat. So she left her. Husband moved to New York with her mom and she started to move away from just singing gospel music and started singing a little bit of secular music.

[01:14:35] Mm-hmm. So people were like, what are you doing? And she's like, no, this is fun, let's do it. And then people were like, no, this is dumb. But she didn't care. So within a few months, and she's living in New York City, she started playing at the Cotton Club. And the Cotton Club was like a huge, Ja it's a jazz club, I believe.

[01:14:51] Mm-hmm. In Harlem at the time. So this is probably around the thirties you know, the Harlem Renaissance, and she was playing at Carnegie Hall. [01:15:00] She made friends with Duke Ellington Cab Callaway. Dizzy. Dizzy Gole B, sorry. So. She, you know, all these big names. She became very good friends with them.

[01:15:12] She was playing at all these clubs in New York. So this is a quote from a book called Tough Mothers that I really like. And she was in this book. But in her fame, Thorpe found she was walking a tightrope. She had to not be too religious for the secular New York City and not too inauthentic for the church audiences down south.

[01:15:29] Instead of bending to one or the other, she pushed ahead with her own unique blend of the two. She refused to be pigeonholed as a novelty for New Yorkers, and she refused to stick to the calcified history of Gospel's tradition she instead kept pushing her blend of gospel and dance music , further and further, and thus was born, what we know as rock and roll.

[01:15:50] So a lot of people call Sister Rosetta Thorpe. Wow. Yeah, the mother of rock and roll. You know, this is before Elvis and before [01:16:00] all of those other guys and that they mention all the time. But, and she was one of the first women to play the electric guitar the way that she did. So it was very unique.

[01:16:10] This is

[01:16:10] Chelsea: so cool. Oh my God. I'm, you know, after this I'm gonna be on a whole Rosetta THP bender. I'm like, it's over. I'm like, Sam, you just gave me a, a new hyperfocus on Saturday

[01:16:23] Ashley: brick. Three hours later you go, you're Rosetta THP expert.

[01:16:28] Chelsea: Right? Like, can we go back to that podcast? And I have more to say.

[01:16:32] Ashley: Now I have more to say.

[01:16:36] Oh God, she's amazing. She is, she's, this is, I can't wait to to read more. I really can't. Oh my God, you're so funny. She, so she. Her voice was super powerful. She, so at this point she realized, she was like, damn, I'm actually the shit. So she's like, I'm gonna get rid of this. And her ex-husband, who she like left, the only thing she kept from him [01:17:00] was the last name.

[01:17:01] And she started going by the name Sister Rosetta Farp. And she was touring and she started partnering with other acts. One of the acts she partnered with, or was a lady named Marie Knight, and they rumored to be lovers, mm-hmm. Which was probably true. So, so, of course for the time it wasn't cool to be gay or bisexual, so she was always like, no, no, I'm not, but many people, this is my buddy.

[01:17:23] Yeah. She's just, we're just good friends. But many people knew that she was bisexual or gay, which we don't know how she identified, but everybody kind of knew it wasn't a secret and Right, right. You think there was a lot of people like little Richard, you know, he never said that, right. Yeah. But he was gay and yeah, they mentioned somebody else.

[01:17:40] Like there was a bunch of people. Mm-hmm. Who were in the community, but they just, you know, it wasn't cool back then, so you couldn't say it. But anyway, so she also started a all band, all girls band called The Rots. And it was really cute cuz I like that name. The Rots. It's adorable.

[01:17:55] So she actually too, she got really, really good at [01:18:00] business cuz she was started managing her own career basically. Mm-hmm. And because she had to go down south and she was a black woman she had to figure out how she could go and perform and navigate this Jim Crow South that she was, you know, she was from that area, but she was super, super smart.

[01:18:15] So what she would do, she bought her own tour bus so that she didn't Yeah. So she didn't have to stay in hotels and that she could eat on the bus whenever she wanted. She could order food and she hired a white driver so that if they wouldn't let her in, the white driver would be like, Hey, I'm a white guy.

[01:18:30] They'd be like, oh great, you're a white guy. And then yeah, they would let him in. Yeah. She was smart. So she would do all that. Wow. Yeah. So then one time, so I guess her, her popularity started to wane a little bit, so she decided to like, have a concert slash wedding. She's like, I'm gonna two for one baby.

[01:18:51] So she's like, so she found,

[01:18:52] Chelsea: she's like, I told you I was resourceful. I told you exactly. I made a, like how innovative she [01:19:00] had to be Yes. To literally go around all of that red tape. Mm-hmm. Or white tape,

[01:19:07] Ashley: if you will,

[01:19:09] Chelsea: but like, really, and, and then having to create like, her old, like she saw every boundary mm-hmm.

[01:19:16] And was like, Mary, I'll just go around. That's amazing. I love it. I's know, that's what I aspire to, you know, like if, if it's not built, I'll build it. Okay. So she, so it was a concert

[01:19:28] Ashley: wedding? Yes. She had a concert wedding, so she had to find somebody. She's like, this is a great idea, but now I gotta find a dude.

[01:19:34] I guess. So she goes and she

[01:19:36] Chelsea: finds one. Was it like for, I wonder if it was like for tax runs off purposes, where she was like, who knows? It was a

[01:19:42] Ashley: business thing. Sure, I know. But then it, she was innovative. She was very innovative. So she ended up having, she met this guy in a few months and then she ended up having this wedding concert thing.

[01:19:54] Concert, yeah. And people were like, that's wild. But this guy ended up being kind of a dick too. Aww. Yeah, he [01:20:00] sucked. He was on, fuck. He spent all her money and she had like a couple bad managers. So by the late 1950s, she wasn't really doing so well. Right. So she went to Europe because apparently at this time in Europe, people started really like gospel music.

[01:20:15] Yes.

[01:20:16] Chelsea: It's interesting because once you're like semi washed up here mm-hmm. You go to London and it's like, yeah, baby, the comeback. That's what happened to Judy Garland. But then she died unfortunately in that comeback. Yes. For some reason these comebacks like, and I'm thinking about Michael Jackson also like didn't make it for his comeback.

[01:20:37] Anyway, sorry. There's just No, it's fine. Rant, I think. But like Yeah. People who go to

[01:20:41] Ashley: Europe. Yeah. Is it Judy Garland, who, I think she was the ambassador to Ghana for a while. No, that was Shirley Temple. I'm trying to figure that out. That makes sense. Yeah. I think it was Shirley Temple because my, I remember my dad that, my dad's from Ghana, so the only way he ever knew Shirley Temple was like, oh yeah, she was the ambassador for a while.

[01:20:57] I was like, what's

[01:20:59] Chelsea: so funny? Yeah. [01:21:00] She got into politics.

[01:21:01] Ashley: Yes. She actually did get into policy. Yeah. I was like, hot Shirley. Curly. Curly Shirley. Anyway, curly Shirley. Alright, that's fine. So then, all right, so, okay. She went to Europe. You know, who else went to Europe? I mean, didn't Tina Turner like move to Germany, but then she got married?

[01:21:16] I think that makes sense

[01:21:17] Chelsea: too. Yeah. I'm like, I feel like I've heard some side story about something like that. And then like a lot of celebrities just retreat to like, like a gala Galapagos. Yeah. You know, like, I don't know,

[01:21:25] Ashley: something. They're like, I just Google 'em right away. Right. Yeah. I feel

[01:21:29] Chelsea: like they, I feel like I've known several Hollywood peeps that are just like, now I have like, like Lenny Kravitz, right?

[01:21:36] Doesn't he hide away and

[01:21:37] Ashley: like, he lives on like, okay, he lives in a, that van. Yes. He lives in a van on a beach in Barbados or something. He's like, yeah, I just live here now. And we're like, are you, you're good though. He's like, yeah, I'm fine. We're like, okay, Lenny.

[01:21:52] Chelsea: I love it. I love

[01:21:53] Ashley: it. Lenny crap. Yes, I remember, sorry, this is so random.

[01:21:57] I'm gonna get back to the story, but I think, I don't know what [01:22:00] grade I was in. Maybe I was in like sixth or seventh grade when that you know, that song. Okay. Sorry, I'm not seeing it very well. I'm Dan. No, it's

[01:22:08] Chelsea: fine. I'm just, I probably don't know it anyway.

[01:22:10] Ashley: Okay. Don't worry. It's a good song. I don't know what's it's like.

[01:22:13] I'll be okay. Never see you again though. I love the Kravitz family. Yeah. Oh, me too. I love them. They're all such good looking people. It's like annoying, right? It's sick. I wanna stop it. I'm like, oh, okay. And then she was like, oh, you know what I'm gonna do Lisa Vene. I'm just gonna get married to Jason maoa.

[01:22:28] What the hell's going on here? Like,

[01:22:30] Chelsea: okay, everybody just drinking their God juice.

[01:22:34] Ashley: And then Jason maoa is like, you know what? Lenny Kravis is literally one of my best friends. I was like, you all need to stop being so sweet. I know it's you And yeah, like, Ew, stop that. Stop it. It's adoring.

[01:22:45] Chelsea: Stop it. I think it might be, I, I think this also just shows also a bigger thing, which is like, they have money, they have the ability to like, not just focus on like, Socio Yes.

[01:22:57] Like social, social concepts of like, [01:23:00] that's weird. Or You should be hateful, or Yeah.

[01:23:02] Ashley: They're all just like, no, we're like in good. Our mental health is in good standing and we are all just learning to be cool. And I'm like, wow. Like that's amazing. Yes, it is amazing. But I remember like, I think I, yeah, I think I was in elementary school or maybe early middle school and that's the song I think is called again, and the video has Lenny Kravitz butt in it.

[01:23:22] I remember being like, Lenny Kravitz butt don't,

[01:23:25] Chelsea: I was like, oh my god. That's like such a, I don't know if you saw Turning Red.

[01:23:29] Ashley: No, but I wanna

[01:23:30] Chelsea: see it. I've never seen it. I, my daughter likes it. I know she's only four, but we like, we like Four Town. They like sing in it. Anyway. Like, it's like a fake band, but it very much replicates like being a millennial mm-hmm.

[01:23:40] In the early two thousands, like being in middle school. Yes. And I vibe with that as I am turning 34 this year, but, you know, like, it, it's very clearly that. And it just reminded me of like where she would say something like that. Yeah, I know. It's totally fine. I'm like, that's a really long

[01:23:59] Ashley: [01:24:00] story for nothing.

[01:24:01] No. Sorry. Keep going. Kravis. It's fine. I remember. No, it's fine. You're hilarious. I remember seeing his butt. I going to school, be like you guys listen, I, I. Salt Lake. It's butt yesterday. I saw it. I'm feeling all sorts of ways about

[01:24:16] Chelsea: it. I would like to talk about this. Click.

[01:24:20] Ashley: I might need to go and look and see that butt again.

[01:24:23] This is great. I don't know why. Just something in my, something about it I know is really awesome. Just something to me. Right. So weird. Okay. Sorry, everybody I had to talk about Lynn Cross's butt, so had to, had to, so it's necessary now. Okay, so she went to Europe, then she was there for a while and then she got back to America and everybody's like, wait, we really like you again.

[01:24:51] We like gospel and pop music. And she's like, great. So for 10 more years she started going on tour. She was going hard, she was playing, she was making [01:25:00] albums and her friends were like, sister, you gotta calm down. She's like, I'm never calming down. So she probably did not say that, but she did. So dang, you never know.

[01:25:09] Maybe So then sounds like. Her hand started to get numb. She's a guitar player. That's not good. Oh, like carpal tunnel. So she found out she had undiagnosed diabetes. So she had some nerve damage. Yeah. So diabetes. I know. Not the diabetes. So then she, unfortunately she had to get her leg amputated, but she didn't care cuz she, sister Rose Clark.

[01:25:35] This woman, she, yeah, she got her leg amputated. But then she went back on stage and she said, no problem. I'm gonna hop. She did. When her guitar at her one leg, she said, it doesn't matter. I could have zero legs. I'm gonna play my guitar. So then I am

[01:25:50] Chelsea: dead. Oh my God,

[01:25:52] Ashley: I need so bad. But then in 1973, a few years later after she [01:26:00] recovered, well, didn't really recover, but she got her leg cut off.

[01:26:02] She died. And like I said, that so awkwardly he died. The

[01:26:09] Chelsea: way you said it was a very windy Williams. She

[01:26:12] Ashley: died. I know. Sound.

[01:26:14] Chelsea: Just because like the like minor jersey and everything came. Yes, she

[01:26:18] Ashley: died. She died. Yeah, she died and it was real sad. And then actually she died a day before she was supposed to release a new album.

[01:26:26] So that was terrible. . And then her husband was a dick and he spent all that money. So she actually doesn't have a headstone. And to this day she's in an unmarked grave. Isn't that, that's shitty of her husband. But the thing that it sucks, that part sucks. But the thing that I love about Sister of Bev Arp is that people, people who are besides everything, besides besides everything and her being just a badass, is that she didn't give a shit about what anybody thought she should do.

[01:26:54] She was just like, I'm gonna do whatever I want. Yes. And then again from Tough Mothers, this book I love so much[01:27:00] he says, but perhaps the larger issue with her legacy was a difficulty of summarizing her leg. No. Oh no, her leg. Oh no. Oh, sorry. No, it's okay. It's okay. Dark. It's fine. She's fine. She's fine now.

[01:27:20] She was a study. She's at peace. She's at peace. She was a studying contradictions, a gospel singer with a secular bent, a conservative persona who'd swear like a sailor, a sweet and sincere soul who manufactured her own wedding for purity and a boisterous, flawed magnificently human soul. I love that.

[01:27:40] that's so

[01:27:41] Chelsea: nice, isn't it? Like that is so human. So human to just. Try to strive against all odds. Mm-hmm. To be successful and express yourself and do your thing. Do your art, creating it. I mean, the fact that she also didn't let the amputation stop her, like so many people [01:28:00] would get self-conscious about that.

[01:28:01] Mm-hmm. But to have the ability to just see past that yourself and like, that's beautiful, isn't

[01:28:08] Ashley: it? Yeah. I'm just go Sister Roseo. I know. I was like, man, my sister actually told me about, This woman years ago, cuz my sister plays guitar, she's very talented. And I was like, okay, whatever. And then like, not okay, whatever.

[01:28:25] But I was like, okay, cool. And then when I actually read this story I was like, oh shit. And I text my sister the other day. I was like, I remember that lady you told me about actually really cool. She's like, yeah, I told you that. Jesus Christ, Ashley, now

[01:28:36] Chelsea: you're, now you're getting it.

[01:28:38] Ashley: Right. So ju okay, so now this comes to the end of our show.

[01:28:45] This has been so fun. Like this has been amazing. Yeah, no, it's been so fun. So Chelsea, just tell everybody. If they wanna hook up with you and they wanna hang out with you, and you wanna, they're like, wait, I wanna get a voice lesson from that lady. She's awesome. Where can they [01:29:00] find you?

[01:29:01] Chelsea: So I have my website, the voice switch.com, which is a very cool website, by the way.

[01:29:05] Thank you. Oh my God. I did it myself, so I'm still like working on it. I love it because I, I do everything by myself. I'm not, I, I know plenty of people that are like, you should spend money on your website. I'm like, I listen, I used to code as a kid. We can do this. Oh, that's cool. Because I was a nerd. I would just code like people's live journals and like make little templates.

[01:29:25] But anyway, that's in a past life, this current life, but in the past. So you can find me on there. I think you can send a little message on that, but honestly, if you're on Instagram, that's the best place to message me. I'd like to just Honestly, you can send me a message and we have a conversation. I really don't, I used to do these like, like cut and dry book now buttons, and then I switched to a, I'm giving you my process.

[01:29:52] That's right. Then I switched to this like form that you had to apply for, which seems intimidating. Mm-hmm. So I would just, [01:30:00] it, it's evolved over time. Honestly, I prefer you just message me and we have a conversation about it. I know that can be scary, but it's a lot easier to have the conversation than to like, shell out, you know?

[01:30:10] A hundred bucks, you know, like at, at, you know, at all at once. But you can also work with me. I have a karaoke coven that's actually starting next Monday next Friday, May 26th. I don't know if this is airing after that though. Yes, it will, but that's okay. That's fine. But we have the karaoke coven covenant's only $10 a month and it provides support for your voice.

[01:30:30] I have a group Discord on there where I have song suggestions. I send karaoke tracks and then we show up online and we all mute ourselves and you get to sing and showcase what you've been working on, get some feedback if you'd like, but mostly get support and some options how to like you know, help some of your technique if you're feeling like you need some assistance.

[01:30:51] And it's like the lowest price option because I just wanna build community. I'm not looking to like make this anything I'm trying to profit off of.[01:31:00] Because I really do want it to just build the community and have people feel safe and a safe container. And I have policies to make sure everybody's safe.

[01:31:08] And if we're, if there is harm that's caused, like we're gonna, we're gonna work on it, we're gonna make sure

[01:31:14] Ashley: that she's gonna scratch 'em. Yeah. Whatever happens, yeah. I'm gonna

[01:31:18] Chelsea: scratch it. You'll bleed safer space. But yeah, it's, it's, so I do that and then yeah, if you're in person, I do a lot of healing work in person, but I don't know if anyone listenings from Fort Wayne I know, but yes, reach out to me online or on social media.

[01:31:36] Again, it's the voice switch.co.com was taken, and it's not even a website right now. It's like somebody's just got the, I'm like, you're rude. I know you're rude. You didn't let me.com it. And I actually have like a brand that I'm doing. But anyway yeah. My favorite thing is to work with neuro divergent people.

[01:31:56] People that are just trying to find their voices. Maybe people trying to like get into like [01:32:00] community theater auditions or start their journey. Because I just, I have such a soft spot for people just starting out because it can be really scary and a lot of people don't put you in the right direction.

[01:32:10] Some people just wanna monetize off of you, and that's really not the goal either. And I am also like low commitment. You don't have to commit to a, a whole month. You could do a la carte, you could do one lesson, you could do two lessons you know, whatever feels good. And I've also written an ebook called The Awakened Artist.

[01:32:26] Hmm. And that's also available on my website. And it's basically, if you wanna sing, but don't wanna do all of the things that I said that involve singing, like you're not even there yet. This gets you from like, I call it like the couch to 5K of singing, getting you from like nothing. To like actually creating.

[01:32:44] And we work on modalities that help you increase your artistic ability and get you just a little bit more into like the things that you, like, your hobbies. It's just a way to incorporate a little bit more freedom in your life. And then you get to start creating some art then. [01:33:00]

[01:33:00] Ashley: Yay. Yay. Everybody followed Chelsea on Instagram especially because she has the best Instagram.

[01:33:06] Your Instagram is so cute. I love it. It is,

[01:33:08] Chelsea: it is a crazy dump of like nineties movies that I make into memes.

[01:33:13] Ashley: Oh, I love how you put a lot of Fran Drescher on there. Oh my God. I am like a dedicated nanny. I used to, I love the nanny. Me and my mom used to lo, we used to watch a lot of the nanny, so

[01:33:25] Chelsea: you know what?

[01:33:25] It just never misses. And it's always just like a, you know, it's like no str there aren't scenarios where you're like, oh my God, what's gonna happen? It's kind of like very like, you know The Lucy Show? Yes. You know, it's like, I love Lucy. It's very much like, oh no, situational drama. And it's like, but it's very light.

[01:33:43] Yes. You don't have to, but, but the comedy, it gives back like, it's like so, so good. I know. So

[01:33:49] Ashley: funny. I used to love writing how her mom, sorry. I know I'm talking about the nanny now. How her mom was just always randomly showing up and eating everything. Yes. Music said

[01:33:56] Chelsea: killing me. Yes. Oh my, one of my favorite scenes [01:34:00] is my blood br my blood sugar.

[01:34:02] My blood sugar. Get the medicine. And she, she goes, mom, she goes into the cabinet, gets the chocolate syrup bottle, puts it on a tablespoon, and she goes,

[01:34:13] Ashley: Like, ugh, I

[01:34:15] Chelsea: love her. Like relate, just relatable, foodie things and just, you know, if you, if you have trouble, like I know with, with the things you're eating, like it's a very calming show for people that like to eat too.

[01:34:29] Yes. It, it does not shame people. Like she would, there are a lot of quotes that just make you feel like very food positive too. Yes. And I think that also gives me like, great vibes because there's like one scene where she like Fran Dresher, she, she puts two slices of pizza together and they're like, Fran, that's, that's not one slice.

[01:34:48] And she goes, the body doesn't know.

[01:34:54] Ashley: It never misses the lies

[01:34:55] Chelsea: that you like, the lies that you tell yourself. You know? Like what It's like one [01:35:00] thing in space, time and space. So who

[01:35:02] Ashley: cares? You know, that show never miss, it's always, it's always funny. Oh my God. I love when I'm, when I first started seeing you post franchise show, I was like, dun, nanny.

[01:35:12] I

[01:35:12] Chelsea: was so excited. Also so iconic. Yes. I'm so iconic.

[01:35:16] Ashley: All her outfits. Oh my god. Iconic. Yes. Yes,

[01:35:18] Chelsea: yes, yes. Oh my God. Oh God. I aspire, I wish I had that vibe, but I know it's

[01:35:24] Ashley: okay. Me too, but I, I can't do it, but it's okay. Thank God for her. Well, Thank you Chelsea for being here. Thank you. And then once again, I'm gonna plug myself cuz that's what you gotta do sometimes.

[01:35:35] So again, we're dying with a divine on, I always say we, it's just me, but I don't know. I always say that just feels comfortable. Yeah. To like bring, like I have a team of producers. No, it's just me and my kitchen right now. Yes. Died with a Divine on Facebook and at Dine With a Divine on Instagram.

[01:35:54] Again, if you like the show, you can subscribe, you can give us a five star rating that helps other people find us. You can [01:36:00] email me with anything you wanna say it. Dine with the Divine Pod at Gmail. And if you wanna follow me, Ashley, I'm at Sankofa hs. That's s A N K O F A H S on Instagram. And I'm Sankofa Healing Sanctuary and Facebook.

[01:36:14] And thank you everybody for being here and I hope you have an awesome, amazing week. And thanks again Chelsea, and this has been awesome. Thank you. Bye everybody. Bye.